Scott Galloway · 35:42
Alexa, tell me more about hot weather. It's gonna say, Scott, would you like to cut your health insurance costs in half? If yes, say, Alexa, tell me more about Amazon Prime insurance.
Kara Swisher · 35:53
Mhmm.
Scott Galloway · 35:54
They'll go into insurance because they will be able to look at a family and say, this family has a low body mass index. They are in monogamous relationships. They eat well. That means actuarially they are a good risk. So we're going to offer them, we're going to offer them better insurance costs, and we'll do it at 3% margin instead of 45 margin. And all of a sudden, people are going to go, oh my gosh, I can get health insurance for less. And one of the things, one of the things, if you read the announcement around PillPack, is they're going after uninsured. They're saying if you're uninsured, it's not a problem, and we're going to negotiate on your behalf. We're going to be a fiduciary for you. Whereas if you're uninsured, you're taught to believe by the industry that you're being irresponsible, that you're a bad person. You're a bad father. And they're saying... They're actually saying it's a cohort. It's a big cohort, and we're gonna we're gonna negotiate with them.
Kara Swisher · 36:46
Banked, which is their next area of attack, I suppose.
Scott Galloway · 36:49
Great analogy.
Kara Swisher · 36:50
It's a
Scott Galloway · 36:50
great analogy.
Kara Swisher · 36:51
You know? It's really... It's just shitty experiences for people that have money, and the people who have money have to pay out the nose too. Like, the idea of going into a doctor's office, like, especially during the pandemic is... You know, dentists are one thing. You kinda have to arrive with your teeth. Right? You got... You have to sort of have them work on your actual teeth. But a lot of the stuff you go to the doctors for is so useless.
Scott Galloway · 37:13
It's information, which can be digitized.
Kara Swisher · 37:15
Yeah. Except for some of the diagnostic stuff, some of the very serious... Like, I'm just thinking the only doctor I've been to during this pandemic is a dentist because I have some dental issues. And Mhmm. You you have to. And and they're great, by the way. I've never had a dentist. I never feel, like, unhappy with my service there. But people have to be thinking more about service around health care, and health care workers better be thinking around service, which I think is is for the vast majority of people. And, again, you're right. Amazon could really take aim at people who feel left out of the health care system, which is interesting since, you know, politicians are gonna have to wrestle with, you know, Medicare for all or one single payer, etcetera, etcetera. It is an opportunity. It also is a frightening prospect that Amazon would have all your health information along with all your eating and consuming information. So there's Consumers
Scott Galloway · 38:05
will fork it over in a hot minute because they'll get
Kara Swisher · 38:07
so much They can, but
Scott Galloway · 38:08
they'll get so much utility in exchange.
Kara Swisher · 38:10
They're also gonna become a big fat target for government.
Scott Galloway · 38:13
Yeah. But around antitrust, but around data. And I'll let you know, I'm no fan of Amazon. They... They're one of the few companies that really hasn't experienced a major hack. Although you and I have a bond. The only place... Well, one of the few places I've been to a couple times, not since the pandemic pandemic began, is in fact the dentist. And I don't have serious issues, but I go I absolutely love it. I get nitrous. I listen to Super Tramp. Think I'm serious. I'm totally this is 100% serious. I think about my mom, think about my kids, and I have a good cry, and I leave feeling better. It's literally my dentist is my therapist. It's totally my therapist. Okay. Everything I just said is true.
Kara Swisher · 38:48
Seriously, I'm touch is you did attack Amazon last year and so much so that they were actually a sponsor for one of our events. They were like, we are never coming back. And because of Scott Galloway, I'm like, fine. See you later.
Scott Galloway · 38:59
Oh, no. Let let me let me be clear. Let me be clear. I had be clear. Amazon Amazon should be broken up. They should be broken up. And while I get huge enjoyment out of being a spectator to what is the mother of all midlife crises unfolding, I e Jeff Bezos. And his adventures in amateur photography. Oh my god. Don't say that about Jeff. Don't say that about Jeff. He's an innovator. Anyways, anyways Go right in. While I'm enjoying it, oh, they should absolutely be broken up into Amazon AWS and Amazon fulfillment. But I... Look. There's just no getting around it. Jeff Bezos will go down as the most innovative, biggest brain business thinker in the history of business. Full stop.
Kara Swisher · 39:37
I would agree. I think we're on the same page there, but we're all terrified of him in any case, nonetheless. Yeah. Though he's not a particularly terrifying person. And I'm glad that his wife has gotten so much of the stock that she can give away the money.
Scott Galloway · 39:50
Well, let me let me do... I mean, think... Okay. You wanna talk about money? Yeah. You and I both been divorced. Did you get wealthier in the year you got divorced? His wealth has increased $30,000,000,000.
Kara Swisher · 40:00
Wealthy as my ex. I didn't take very much money.
Scott Galloway · 40:03
Yeah. Yeah. But I'm gonna
Kara Swisher · 40:06
I mean, I did for work.
Scott Galloway · 40:07
Okay. So you got wealthier. Jeff Bezos increased his wealth by about $50,000,000,000 the same year he got divorced. That gives you a sense of just how much how much... I I did a infographic on what this guy could buy with his wealth. Do you realize right now Jeff Bezos is worth more than every person living in DC, Wyoming, Alaska, Kentucky, and I think over the last two weeks, he's added Montana. Yeah. Everybody. Everybody. He's worth more
Kara Swisher · 40:33
Yeah.
Scott Galloway · 40:33
That's about right. Than big swaths of America right now.
Kara Swisher · 40:36
Yeah. Yeah. He's tight. They hit someone late.
Scott Galloway · 40:38
Oh, but we have to close our schools. America. America. Have say that's
Kara Swisher · 40:43
straight because there was this idea that if Jeff Pavos gave a $100,000 to every one of employees, they could... He could he could do it in four seconds or whatever. I was like, why does he have to do that? Like, everyone was like, he should because he's rich. And I'm like, doesn't have to.
Scott Galloway · 40:55
Sense. He should pay taxes is what he should do.
Kara Swisher · 40:57
Yes. Exactly. That's what I said. That's... Was my answer. Anyway, okay, Scott. Let's go to a listener mail question.
Scott Galloway · 41:03
You've got you've got I can't believe I'm gonna be a mailman. You've got mail.
Speaker · 41:08
Hi, Karen Scott. This is Bob in Brooklyn. I really love your work, and I have followed the breakdown of the WeWork debacle very closely. I believe this story is an important cautionary tale, but not in the terms that it's often discussed. This kind of toxic charisma that's weaponized by mounds of cash is the central story, I think. The biggest victims being the many idealistic young people that Newman convinced to waste years of their lives serving his ego without fair compensation or the big promised payout at the end. Since we know that good relationships and mentorship is so essential to prosperity and happiness, what advice do you have for young people just starting out in their careers that might help them avoid being exploited? Specifically, I'm curious what telltale signs you've noticed over your long careers that indicates someone might be using their charisma to swindle time or money from you or someone else. Thanks so much.
Scott Galloway · 41:59
Jesus. That guy's that guy's a sexy beast.
Kara Swisher · 42:01
Bob is my new partner on Pivot. What a genius.
Scott Galloway · 42:05
Will that guy marry me or adopt I
Kara Swisher · 42:08
like Bob.
Scott Galloway · 42:08
Bob is really safer just listening to him.
Kara Swisher · 42:11
Bob, toxic charisma. I think you have toxic charisma, Scott Galloway.
Scott Galloway · 42:14
Really?
Kara Swisher · 42:15
I think that's
Scott Galloway · 42:15
I'm I'm one of those things, and, unfortunately, it's the toxic part. Little little low on the charisma part.
Kara Swisher · 42:21
Talking about this charisma thing this week for some reason because someone was... I I written a story about the sort of the the sheen is off. I think the sheen is off Donald Trump, but he has toxic charisma. And whenever I say that people go crazy, they're like, he's not charismatic. I'm like, no. He is. Whether you like it or not. And I think toxic charisma is really a better way to put it that they will calm themselves down. This is a really good question. Where should we start, Scott? Would you like to start? What advice would you have? There there are differences between a Steve Jobs and an Adam Neumann, and there's a lot of people in between. And there's people with no charisma whatsoever at the same time who do very well. So talk about this issue about mentorship and and that.
Scott Galloway · 43:02
Well, this this is a this is a deep issue that we should have Esther Perel or someone who actually knows what they're talking about on who has actual training domain expertise. But what he's basically talking about is a sociopath. Mhmm. Cult leaders are very, very charismatic, and so are sociopaths. You know, I forget the guy's name. The guy
Kara Swisher · 43:19
Keith Ranieri.
Scott Galloway · 43:20
I mean, they are very captivating. And not only that, I don't... I wouldn't describe Steve Jobs' charisma. Look. Steve Jobs, the Jesus Christ of our information age, is a man who denied his own blood under oath to avoid child support payments when he was worth a $250,000,000, and that's our hero. And so I I would argue that Steve Jobs is guilty of that saying, I don't think Donald Trump
Kara Swisher · 43:42
complex than that, but I will... I'll let I'll let it go. But go ahead.
Scott Galloway · 43:45
That's unforgivable. Full stop. Unforgivable.
Kara Swisher · 43:48
Okay. Sorry. I think the story is a little more complex, but go ahead. Go ahead.
Scott Galloway · 43:52
Anyways, it says...
Kara Swisher · 43:53
Okay. They're not gonna argue with it. Nonetheless, he's not on the list.
Scott Galloway · 43:56
Call me late at night and cursing me. Call me late at night in
Kara Swisher · 43:59
cursing me. God, Stephanie Earl. That must
Scott Galloway · 44:01
have been exciting for me. I was like, go on. Yeah. I
Kara Swisher · 44:04
figured you'd like that. Oh my god. And let's get... Speaking of toxic charisma.
Scott Galloway · 44:08
Socio Fast. Look. What are the tests? I think the tests are, first off, and I don't think Trump didn't have the really dangerous toxic because you noticed it with Trump. There are some people. So for example, Michael Bloomberg was happy to sit in the back and let other people take credit. I think when people are always, it's always about them, that's a bad sign. I think when people... I think you look at the the relationships they have with people who are close to them. Are they generous, loving people? I always say to women, and I know this sounds weird, find out if your boyfriend, what his relationship is like with his mother, and check out his Netflix home screen. Those are the two tests, the Rorschard test into someone's into someone's soul. But I think there's a variety of tests around spotting a sociopath. Do they have a victim complex? Or do they have huge delusions of their... Do they exaggerate their own success and their own grandeur? There are there are a list of things that you can go through, which quite frankly reads like reads like the public behavior of Mark Zuckerberg and Schells Sandberg. They are literally... They define sociopathy if you look at their their behavior, in my opinion, over the last
Kara Swisher · 45:12
thirty six have charisma, I would say.
Scott Galloway · 45:15
Sheryl Sandberg is hugely charismatic.
Kara Swisher · 45:17
She she is, but she's now put herself in a hole, essentially. But Mark
Scott Galloway · 45:21
goes up. But she's hugely charismatic.
Kara Swisher · 45:23
Yeah. She is. For sure. But I don't think it was overwhelming in this same way. I think Mark is sort of the anti charisma kind of person.
Scott Galloway · 45:30
But what do you think? How do you think you recognize toxic charisma?
Kara Swisher · 45:33
You know, it's interesting. The the... I think victimization whenever they free attack, the the people I've covered who are I find the most toxic are... You know, I'm thinking of Travis Kalanick, very charismatic, very... Great presenter, great people, or he's... There's a really good story in the in the Washington Post today by Ben Terris, who's one of my favorite writers, about Trump's guys. Right? They... This guy has guys around him, and they listed Michael Cohen and etcetera, etcetera. There's lots of them. And and they interviewed one of them that... What's his name? The guy who did the the the the... We've got we've got bad stuff about Hillary. Goldstone? Rob Goldstone? Whatever. He he was... It was really interesting because they all sort of fell for this guy and then got screwed, essentially. And so... And you see it in tech too when you look around at all these people, and they do. They have they have persecution complexes or... Which are... Which become clear once you start pushing back on them. They have... They're really... You can't look away from them. That's one of the things. You really are interested in how they present and you listen to them. They've got incredibly loyal people around them who then turn on them later. You know what I mean? They're... They always have that. They... There's always sort of a I loved him. Now I hate him kinda thing, which is really fascinating to me. And when you're in that situation, when you take advantage of it, it's when you're a young person going into one of these companies, you kinda like that leader. You like that leader to... Because you don't want a leader who's soft or weak... Seems weak or is... Tells you that the world is complex. You want a leader that tells you, no. Everything's... We're gonna go this way, and this is the way to go. And so I think what you have to do is realize that life is complex. And when a leader is telling you it's gonna be difficult and here's the upsides and downsides, don't think of that as weak. And you do hear that from young people. They're... Oh, they told me it's gonna be hard or this is gonna be this. And so anyone who tells you things, you know, we're gonna push through or you have... You know, it sounds dumb, but when the boardroom... The boardroom at Uber was called War Room or something like that. It was some aggressive name, and I was like, oh, that's not good. When stuff like that happens, it's not... You have to sort of start to wonder why you need to show that level insecurity. I was visiting, someone. He had a... Everything in his office was aggressive, and I was like, oh, what is this guy? What insecurity is this guy hiding? And so I think those are the kind of signs when you have to sort of be part of a cheer squad or there's short little phrases or you have, like, saying... Like, that kind of stuff can be good, but it actually mostly seems to be bad. Scott?
Scott Galloway · 48:10
I look at this through the lens of small business and what I coach young people around, or my observation around different types of leadership attributes and who you wanna be drawn to and get as mentors. I find there's, loosely speaking, two types of leaders. And that is the inspiring leader who can really rally a room, outline a vision, motivate you, bring everyone together, the kind of all hands. I'm calling in all hands right away, make people feel as if they have a purpose. And then there's what I call the player coach. And a player coach is the person that pulls up their chair next to you as you're doing, putting together a deck for the board, and they they help you get through it. They teach you. They provide feedback. But I call it the people who pull their chair up next to yours and help you learn.
Kara Swisher · 48:55
Mhmm.
Scott Galloway · 48:55
So and this sounds self aggrandizing, you know, like a sociopath. I'm the first. Can pull together a group of people in a room and tell them this is why we're here. Yeah.
Kara Swisher · 49:05
You're very inspiring.
Scott Galloway · 49:06
I'm I'm great at that. My co founder at L two is the ultimate player coach, Catherine Dillon. I constantly saw her sitting at other people's desks, not only telling them what to do, but teaching them how to do it. And and when she walked away, they were better professionals. The latter is much more important and much better for the long term of a company. Because ultimately over time, if you're at a company long enough, you're gonna start to realize that a lot of what that person is saying, the inspiring one, is recycled bullshit. Yeah. Agree. It's the person who's willing to invest in your skills and has the discipline. In other words, really observe people's behavior and try to ignore their words. You know, really look at how they behave, how much they invest in other people, how much empathy they have. You know, look at their actions. Just sort of ignore the words for a while. Because the reality is, I've always said that men get turned on with their eyes, women get turned on with their ears. Ignore your ears, and just watch how this person behaves, because there's inspiring leaders and there's player coaches. But in terms of mentors, find the player coaches that are gonna invest in you.
Kara Swisher · 50:15
Yeah. And you do have to have a certainty level when you're a leader. You have to... When people are nervous. But don't be afraid of people who are complex. That's the that's the one thing that people are like, oh, they're not strong. And I'm like, they're just not stupid. They're not saying dumb things with certainty. A lot of people can say things with certainty and then it not be true. You know, like, I'm frequently wrong, but never a doubt is really something I think about a lot, that idea. So when you're a young person, you're gonna put up a level of those inspirational leaders, those never a doubt leaders and things like that. And you really should find people who want to... Who who who aren't use you to... Using you to pull their chariot to greater glory. Although you can do well with those kind of leaders too because they're so ambitious and you... You're useful, but often they discard you. And so one of the... I I I was thinking of one person who... I always used to joke that I would pull his chariot to greater glory. It didn't hurt me. That didn't hurt me in that relationship, but it definitely didn't help. I wasn't better for it, but riding along with a leader like that sometimes can work. But you just have to be aware that you are just, so much fodder for them to get to where they wanna go.
Scott Galloway · 51:23
Well, the key thing though is he asked about, mentorship. Looking at... A lot of it is which stakeholder are you? If you're a younger person looking for a mentor, I think it's the player coach. If you're a shareholder, if you're a shareholder, you want the person who's borderline a sociopath. Yeah. Because that person has to be able to get up in front of shareholders and say, yeah, I'm putting someone on Mars. And along the way, I'm gonna figure out a way to make $50,000,000 by taking them to the space station. And I'm gonna electrify the world, and I'm gonna have a million autonomous taxis within twelve months. It'll be Tesla taxis. I mean, you have to have to be a really Yeah. Unfortunately, storytelling, verging verging on... I don't wanna call it fraud, but let's just call it exaggeration, is the new skill set. Typically, in corporate America, that what was rewarded in the markets was under promising and over delivering. Now it is totally flipped. It's all about the narrative. It's all about over promising and sorta delivering, most delivering enough to show that you may you may get there at some point. But I always think about Elizabeth Holmes, who was also very charismatic. Mhmm. What would have happened if she'd raised another billion dollars and had gotten lucky? Would she... She'd still be, I think, on the cover of Forbes. So there's a fine line between that kind of storytelling charisma and exaggeration. And then, you know, what I'll call near fraud. It's fascinating. But if you're a shareholder, you absolutely want that kind of crazy, charismatic, cult like. I mean, there's there's a reason that company culture is based off the word cult.
Kara Swisher · 52:59
Yep. Yep. Yep. You're right. You're a 100%. That is a 100% right. Although I do think storytelling is good. Like, sometimes when I'm going in a direction, I repeat it over and over again publicly so I can sort of try it out.
Scott Galloway · 53:10
I must get to the dentist. I must get to the dentist.
Kara Swisher · 53:12
You know what I'm talking about. Anyway, Bob from Brooklyn. Listen. Oh my god. Minute Scott.
Scott Galloway · 53:18
Us, Bob.
Kara Swisher · 53:19
Adopt us. You are in. Let me just tell you Scott. Literally...
Scott Galloway · 53:23
I'm like the third season of Twin Peaks or the fourth season of Ozarks. I have a loyal following, but I'm always very close to being canceled. Canceled. You're not gonna kidding.
Kara Swisher · 53:33
Scott. Years. We are together a It's reference. Until this ship goes down. That's how it's going for you. Alright, Scott. One more quick break. We'll get back for predictions.
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Kara Swisher · 54:15
Chronic migraine is 15 or more headache days a month, each lasting four hours or more.
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— Predictions segment begins —
Kara Swisher · 55:09
Why wait? Ask your doctor, visit botoxchronicmigraine.com, or call 18044 to learn more. Okay, Scott. There's only six weeks left in this crazy year, which means about 26 more ridiculous lawsuits from president Trump until we kick him out of his home right now. What do you predict? We'll see as we draw twenty twenty to a close.
Scott Galloway · 55:32
Well, my predictions are boring. I... I'm just... I think this... I think Amazon
Kara Swisher · 55:36
lead with that. That's not very inspiring. Try again inspiring me.
Scott Galloway · 55:39
Player coach. This will happen. Love me. Love me. And all of you brand the dog on your hip and have sex with me. Anyways
Kara Swisher · 55:50
That was a NXIVM reference.
Scott Galloway · 55:52
Yeah. That was that was a NXIVM reference.
Kara Swisher · 55:53
Incredible that they did that. Anyway, go ahead. Sorry.
Scott Galloway · 55:55
Yeah. You gotta think like, okay. Put him in jail, but I'm sorry. Someone brands you. I think you gotta take a little responsibility for that. I don't
Kara Swisher · 56:03
I honestly... Like, what could make people... I I I think there was a lot of coercion going on, but it... Boy. I mean, but boy.
Scott Galloway · 56:10
That's a little weird.
Kara Swisher · 56:11
That's some power for people. Anyway, go ahead.
Scott Galloway · 56:14
Yeah. That's a little weird. I'd be
Kara Swisher · 56:16
like, what? No. Like, no.
Scott Galloway · 56:18
I know. I've been putting off my vasectomy for two years, but someone was gonna brand me? No fucking way.
Kara Swisher · 56:23
Alright. Six... Give me your boring predictions.
Scott Galloway · 56:26
By the way, my doctor down branding. No joke.
Kara Swisher · 56:28
No
Scott Galloway · 56:28
joke. I went in for the consultation, and he said we're gonna do a needle vasectomy. And I said, hey. It's cold in here.
Kara Swisher · 56:33
Oh my god.
Scott Galloway · 56:35
That is good vasectomy humor.
Kara Swisher · 56:37
You don't want any vasectomy humor. Amount of vasectomy humor I want on this show, and now we have a minute of it.
Scott Galloway · 56:44
Okay. Look.
Kara Swisher · 56:44
Predictions, please. And it better not relate to your penis.
Scott Galloway · 56:47
Ahead. Prediction or a suggestion. I think Walmart and Amazon, have the two best supply chains in the world, should distribute and administer the vaccine.
Kara Swisher · 56:57
Oh, it's the army right now.
Scott Galloway · 56:58
One of favorite. I love the army, but that is what I would call the typical macho stupid... I don't wanna call it stupidity. Have tremendous No.
Kara Swisher · 57:06
They're Logistics. They're good at logistics.
Scott Galloway · 57:09
But not not... I'm not... Okay. They're they're really good at supplying submarines and aircraft carriers, but are they good at really going into residential and suburban areas and dealing with the public? I don't see a lot of guys in... The last time I saw a guy with a fatigue in a in a a in a in an AR 15 or an m two, whatever the rifle is called, was back in the LA riots when they when they dispatched them to every corner of Los Angeles. I don't know if they're the right... Let me put it this way. I just think Amazon is in everyone's home. Walmart has incredible supply chain. I think they're the two best supply chains to figure out a way to distribute any product that needs to be absorbed by a consumer quickly, efficiently, and economically. And I also think it would be a great PR move for them. So Walmart and Amazon, I think you should get... Play a key role distributing and administering the vaccine. Nobody can get you ginger ale faster and less expensively and more definitely than Amazon or Walmart. Why would we think it's any different than any other liquid in a vial?
Kara Swisher · 58:07
Well, there's issues around the vaccines. But, yes, I I see your point. There's issues. There... There's a third one that now they were talking about being encouraging, which doesn't... I think it's a single shot, the one in, at Oxford. So they're moving really quickly on these. And I think distribution's gonna be where the next game is with the distribution of these things. They're apparently distributing the early versions. There's very few doses that are coming to this country right away. They're gonna dose people who are under older people and people people who have existing conditions that are dangerous that would be hospitalized. So they're trying to relieve the hospital system, then health care workers, and then the general public. And what's really interesting about the whole distribution system is even with ninety to ninety five percent efficacy, only half the people in The United States are allegedly gonna take it, and then it... And then only ninety percent of those is gonna work on. So it's really not a big part of the population that's gonna get vaccinated right away, even though they should. A hundred percent of the population should be. It's gonna be a much smaller group of people that are act... They're in the thirties Mhmm. That are gonna get vaccinated, which will take relief off the hospital system, but certainly won't solve the problem. So that's... It's gonna be a PR move to get people to take it.
Scott Galloway · 59:22
I agree.
Kara Swisher · 59:22
You know, to to... And that's gonna be the real... You know, especially since Trump has done so much to to make masks a controversy. He's still there for a little while of this, and so as he's gonna muck up this effort, they're not giving the Biden administration any kind of information. So the initial stages of this distribution are gonna be fucked up. I mean, that's my... I mean, it really truly fucked up because he can't possibly not wanna burn to the ground everything behind him as he leaves office, including, including something like this. There's no interest.
Scott Galloway · 59:55
I wouldn't underestimate his that's isn't sociopathy, it's psychopathy. He... I I don't think he gives a good goddamn. Really don't think this is an an an individual with any empathy for anybody else. Do you want a business prediction?
Kara Swisher · 1:00:07
Yeah.
Scott Galloway · 1:00:08
In the next six months, CNN's gonna be sold.
Kara Swisher · 1:00:11
Oh, alright. To whom? It's always gonna almost be sold. So let me... This has been a long running rumor about HBO and CNN. Which one will be
Scott Galloway · 1:00:19
sold first? HBO should be spun. HBO should be spun because they get a higher price. But Yeah. I I I I don't have a dialogue. I don't have any inside information, but I've gotten to know a little bit some of the people at AT and T, and they are smart people. Yeah. And they have an amazing business called wireless. It's a $150,000,000,000 amazing business. And unfortunately, that great business
Kara Swisher · 1:00:37
mind their purchases. Purchases. Okay. Okay.
Scott Galloway · 1:00:39
Yeah, it will be interesting. Two of the worst acquisitions have the term Time Warner in them. So you're but you're gonna see, it could either merge with all the Comcast assets so they could bulk up.
Kara Swisher · 1:00:50
Yeah.
Scott Galloway · 1:00:51
But I don't know. It'll be very interesting to see. But if I'm if I'm over, if I'm running AT and T, I want to sell CNN right now because CNN will announce a sugar high amazing quarter because the election, instead of going four hours, went four days.
Kara Swisher · 1:01:10
Still going.
Scott Galloway · 1:01:11
CNN is gonna have its best ratings since the Iraq War, and they are going to kill it in terms of revenues this quarter. It is the perfect time to pretty up that bitch and put it on the market.
Kara Swisher · 1:01:24
And that's what they're gonna do. Your boyfriend's for sale.
Scott Galloway · 1:01:26
Yeah. He's up for sale. So is Farid, my my professional role model, Farid Zakaria. Seriously,
Kara Swisher · 1:01:32
I love that guy. Makes sense. That makes sense that it's actually in their ballpark, and they can double down.
Scott Galloway · 1:01:36
They bulk up, and it's still a melting ice cube.
Kara Swisher · 1:01:39
Not rejected out of the Comcast system the way AT and T and CNN are... Know what mean? It doesn't... The whole
Scott Galloway · 1:01:44
system Here's the thing. It's the key to private equity. It's all about how you buy it. The AT and T spent a $110,000,000,000 for assets a lot of people, and Tom Rogers pointed out to to me, that weren't as strong or a little bit stronger than what that what Comcast got with Universal. And Universal's assets, they purchased for about a quarter of that price. Yeah. So the bottom line is, you know, Time Warner's amazing assets, but AT and T probably overpaid for it. And it's now this $30,000,000,000 business that's running up ahead long against companies with deeper pockets has stolen the narrative of an amazing $150,000,000,000 business called five g, called wireless, called AT and T. Right. So you're gonna see divestiture of assets, and I think probably the first to go, although I don't think it should be the first to go. I think it should be HBO, but I think probably the first to go will be CNN.
Kara Swisher · 1:02:34
Okay. Give me another buyer besides Comcast. Comcast makes sense to me.
Scott Galloway · 1:02:38
Well, might it might be a a spin on its own or... Okay. So you know who could buy CNN? You know who should buy CNN? Bloomberg. Mark Benioff. Yeah. I mean, if you think about news, news plays such an important role in our society, and news used to be a civic duty. And that is ABC said, okay. We're killing it selling Tang and Chevrolet ads on the Brady Bunch and the Partridge family, and we have a civic responsibility, which no one feels anymore
Kara Swisher · 1:03:05
He does have that. You're right.
Scott Galloway · 1:03:06
To put up the news. And news was a money loser. And then Ted Turner and Rupert Murdoch said, well, if you mix in some novelty, I. E. Partisanship or bullshit or lies Mhmm. You can start turning the news into a money making enterprise. Yeah. And the news has come off the fucking rails, and it's been really bad. There is no truth anymore. There is no news. And so similar, and I don't like to say this, but Jeff Bezos has been a very responsible steward for the Washington Post. We are better off because of the Washington Post. The Yeah. Rupert Murdoch, I hate to say this too. I actually think the Wall Street Journal has played a key key role, although for some reason, he's totally fucked up the news at Fox. Anyways, I think Mark Benioff
Kara Swisher · 1:03:47
He likes to have a lot of different dishes on his table. But go ahead. But think
Scott Galloway · 1:03:50
about how interesting this would be. What if Time, the the magazine he purchased in 2018, reunited with Warner, specifically CNN?
Kara Swisher · 1:03:59
Wow. I like this.
Scott Galloway · 1:04:00
Mark Benioff has the cabbage. I think he's worth, like, 80 or a $100,000,000,000. Mhmm. He, unlike Rupert Murdoch or Mark Zuckerberg or Sheryl
Kara Swisher · 1:04:09
Sandberg attention. He also isn't... He likes attention.
Scott Galloway · 1:04:11
Well, but most importantly, unlike Mark Zuckerberg or Rupert Murdoch, Marc Benioff took civics in high school. Yeah. I think he actually thinks about how his actions and his power and his shareholder value have an impact on
Kara Swisher · 1:04:24
Many many consider that bullshit with him. I don't, actually. I've spent a lot of time with him. And I buy it. He he is. He's a bit of a showman, and he likes the attention, but I don't mind it. I don't mind the way he likes attention. It's okay. It's part... Showmanship is part of his job. And speaking of charismatic leaders, he really is one. And, it's not toxic charisma. It's it's charisma. And he definitely sometimes is a showboat, but I think he's really... You're right. That's a really interesting idea. I like it. I'd like it. I wonder if he has a set.
Scott Galloway · 1:04:52
Just in terms of showboat, I don't know
Kara Swisher · 1:04:53
Let's do it.
Scott Galloway · 1:04:53
I don't know Marc Benioff well. You know him better than me, but I know a decent number of people who work for nonprofits Yeah. Who say that when they're in the tight spot, they call Mark Benioff
Kara Swisher · 1:05:03
Yeah. And he says stuff in San Francisco.
Scott Galloway · 1:05:05
Says he says yes before he hangs up the phone, and he doesn't want a press release, and he doesn't want Yeah. Recognition for it. And I think
Kara Swisher · 1:05:11
You're right. He'd be a good owner.
Scott Galloway · 1:05:12
A chance Zuckerberg initiative.
Kara Swisher · 1:05:14
Time more heft. You know what I mean? Like, he's sort of buying... Time is just too small.
Scott Galloway · 1:05:19
A great owner. Or or you wanna know what the gangster really interesting move would be, Kara?
Kara Swisher · 1:05:23
Alright. Last one.
Scott Galloway · 1:05:24
I'm sorry. I'm going on here. This is a good one.
Kara Swisher · 1:05:26
I like it.
Scott Galloway · 1:05:26
Twitter should buy CNN. Oh. Twitter needs to bust and move to subscription, which means they need to go vertical with proprietary content. They're basically a news organization, and CNN has the largest news gathering
Kara Swisher · 1:05:38
I like that. That's a good one.
Scott Galloway · 1:05:39
The news gathering net in the world, and then you could milk the advertising to hold on to those revenues. Twitter has a $30,000,000,000 market cap. CNN goes for somewhere between 7 and 8,000,000,000.
Kara Swisher · 1:05:49
See, you know, when I knock your head, you come out with some good ideas. This is really good. My last question then, I'm gonna press you. Where does Donald Trump go? The Newsmax guy said he's not selling his assets. I think he's just gonna get a contract with Fox or Newsmax or... There's... He's not starting his own company. Good luck, mister Trump. Not have... Like, it's good. He may get a lot of money, but he's so bad at execution.
Scott Galloway · 1:06:09
That's exactly right.
Kara Swisher · 1:06:10
He's gonna run... You know, I was thinking about this the other day. Trump stakes is not a bad idea. Neither was Trump University. They just they just affiliate with What
Scott Galloway · 1:06:17
about Trump vaca?
Kara Swisher · 1:06:18
And Do
Scott Galloway · 1:06:18
you like that one?
Kara Swisher · 1:06:19
Shitty people, and they do it in a shitty, short term way.
Scott Galloway · 1:06:23
You know?
Kara Swisher · 1:06:24
None of these bad ideas. So he's gonna... He should not start his own media company. He should affiliate with one that's run well. So which one do you think?
Scott Galloway · 1:06:31
Well, the latest one I heard was that he was gonna start his own paid over top thing. That won't work. He's Android. His users, his his customer base is the Fox customer base where, quite frankly, the economy has not been kind to
Kara Swisher · 1:06:43
them. Mhmm.
Scott Galloway · 1:06:44
And they are willing to endure a lot of ads about opioid induced constipation in exchange for free content. But you zeroed on it exactly the right attribute. Running a media company is hard. You know, I lived in New York for twenty years. I know a lot of people that did business tangentially with Trump related organizations. They had a reputation as incompetent operators. Yep. The only thing they ever made money on was Donald Trump firing Omarosa or putting his name on a building and then getting out of the way and collecting his two or 3%. Because when it actually came to operating or running anything
Kara Swisher · 1:07:19
Yeah. Kind of Incompetent.
Scott Galloway · 1:07:21
Donald Trump and the seven dwarves, I. Children, were not known as great operators.
Kara Swisher · 1:07:26
No. And
Scott Galloway · 1:07:26
No. So the idea... You want you want a difficult organization to operate? Try operating a media company. I mean, like, god sakes.
Kara Swisher · 1:07:34
Yeah. He won't be able to do put in shitty people. Think about the
Scott Galloway · 1:07:36
bullshit Bankoff puts up with us, and we're and we're fairly reasonable.
Kara Swisher · 1:07:41
We're not. Poor Bankoff.
Scott Galloway · 1:07:44
Anyway, Poor
Kara Swisher · 1:07:45
in any case, that's
Scott Galloway · 1:07:46
What do you think he's gonna do? What do think he's
Kara Swisher · 1:07:48
gonna do? I think he's gonna take a, like, a a... He's gonna get a $26,000,000 from Fox or something. Whatever whatever the price is. Whatever the highest price is, and then he'll double it in fakeness, and that'll be that. That's what I think he's gonna I think it's start... He... He'll get a lot of money thrown at him by dubious sources, and then he'll get... He's too old, and he's gonna be stuck in lawsuits. And just... I... The fading of Donald Trump, everyone says he's not. I'm gonna... I'm making the bet. This is my prediction, which I made this week, and that thinks it will fade faster than apprentice ratings did. Yeah. I just think Yeah. People love him, but not in three years, not when he's older, not when he's more crazy, not when he's... People get tired of your druncle at Thanksgiving. I just
Scott Galloway · 1:08:30
Jimmy Carter was a terrible president, but a good man. His post presidency goes up strong men and a hung upside down with bullet bullet holes in them.
Kara Swisher · 1:08:38
He go... He's got nowhere to go but down and nowhere to go with but more
Scott Galloway · 1:08:42
You and I are biassed. So just just the counter to that, I I couldn't... I was just blown away. I went to Atlantic Avenue down at Delray Beach, and there was a parade
Kara Swisher · 1:08:52
Yep.
Scott Galloway · 1:08:52
I get Trump, and I just couldn't get over how
Kara Swisher · 1:08:54
passionate he could before. Toxic Toxic charisma. Alright. We're gonna end the show on toxic charisma. It does last, but then it dies rather quickly. There you go. Okay. That's the show. This is a very long show, but that's alright. We're brilliant. Email us with questions about companies and trends in tech and business at pivot@VoxVoxMedia.com. We love your questions. Scott, please read us out.
— Predictions segment ends —
Scott Galloway · 1:09:14
Today's show was produced by Rebecca Sinatas. Fernando Fineta engineered this episode. Erica Anderson is Pivot's executive producer. Thanks also to Hannah Rosen and Drew Burrows. Make sure you subscribe to the show on Apple Podcasts. Or if you're an Android user, check us out on Spotify or, frankly, wherever you listen to podcasts. If you like the show, please recommend it to a friend. Please send in questions. And if you're the anchor of a cable news show, please call me late at night and berate me and tell me what a fucking idiot I am.
Kara Swisher · 1:09:41
About Anderson Cooper.
Scott Galloway · 1:09:41
It hurts so bad. Don't stop. Don't stop. Have a good weekend, Kara.
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Scott Galloway · 1:10:41
See store
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